ajaykkr Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 (edited) isn't it time they made them (the type j's may be close, but are not true blades)..... happy to be the guinea pig to test the protos.... Edited June 12, 2007 by ajaykkr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goshinboku Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 there is a proto set or two out there if i remember correctly. Chris mentioned this in his trip to the Epon factory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blader-X Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 I've been patiently waiting months now for those and am crossing my fingers that they will be in the new lines which will hopefully be released later in the year. It'll all depend upon what they feel they can bring to market and be successful with. That being said, blades are on a serious decline in the eyes of all level of golfers. The new player's cavities are just better and more forgiving and most people opt for that. However, if any company could make a super sweet blade which would rival any performance and forgiveness one could get from a cavity, Epon is that company. My love of blades is apparent from my TSG ID. However, I do have an Epon Type-S 3 iron that will be in the bag here in the next couple of days to play around with. Don't think I'll be changing my ID to Cavity-X anytime soon though as I still have blades in the 4-9 irons! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajaykkr Posted June 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 I've been patiently waiting months now for those and am crossing my fingers that they will be in the new lines which will hopefully be released later in the year. New lines???... maybe i should not succumb to the epon wedges for now... i have too many of them anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+TourSpecGolfer Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 No new blade is coming out. Word from the bird is by late 2007 early 2008 you may see 2 new drivers, a replacement for the Type X, a high bounce technity 58 & 60* version wedge and Epons first putter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blader-X Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 No new blade is coming out. Word from the bird is by late 2007 early 2008 you may see 2 new drivers, a replacement for the Type X, a high bounce technity 58 & 60* version wedge and Epons first putter. All wonderful new except for the blades! But then again, had that feeling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajaykkr Posted June 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 (edited) No new blade is coming out. that sucks..... get them to get one out chris.. Edited June 13, 2007 by ajaykkr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+TourSpecGolfer Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 that sucks..... get them to get one out chris.. If it doesn't perform with better results than traditional blades there is no point really for Epon to produce one. They still consider the type J a muscle back. Ive seen them with tungsten inserts and was told it features the same flight characteristics as a cavity with less forgiveness. There isnt much that can be done that hasn't already been by Endo or other companies in regards to a blade, besides style and stamping of course. If you want a 1020 double pressed butter knife just get the ol MR-23 blade, its Endo forged. My opinion is that if +5 handicaps can deal with cavity backs than so should the low handicapper. Its all about performance and quality not lust and desire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajaykkr Posted June 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 (edited) If it doesn't perform with better results than traditional blades there is no point really for Epon to produce one. They still consider the type J a muscle back.Ive seen them with tungsten inserts and was told it features the same flight characteristics as a cavity with less forgiveness. There isnt much that can be done that hasn't already been by Endo or other companies in regards to a blade, besides style and stamping of course. If you want a 1020 double pressed butter knife just get the ol MR-23 blade, its Endo forged. My opinion is that if +5 handicaps can deal with cavity backs than so should the low handicapper. Its all about performance and quality not lust and desire. dont want this to become a blade vs cavity debate...but I have played a number of cavities, and none of them close to the MP 33, x blade 2s and miura blades (my 3 blade sets)...the bad shots may be better with a cavity, but the good shots are not as good. for me, i am a very good iron /wedge player .... very few bad shots, many many more good shots in a round... off the tee was an issue for me... the epon clubs seems to have solved that problem and my handicap has dropped to the mid single digits this year (and I am confident of hitting close to par soon).... so thats what makes me wonder what an Endo designed (given that they have the benefit of forging so many designs) and forged blade could do to my iron game.... probably nothing...but one still wonders... Thanks for the suggestion on MR-23...any other 1020 double pressed butter knife's forged by endo that are up there with the best... Edited June 13, 2007 by ajaykkr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blader-X Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 Its not so much a debate as it is evolution. Sure blades look great, but bottom line is the newer players cavity backs are outperforming blades in every category. All you need to do is look at the tours and see what the top players are all playing. Even though I play blades (and believe me, am still a big fan of them), I know I could play better with a really well made cavity back set like the ones we have here at TSG. The writing on the wall is very apparent. If nothing else, blades still work well in the 8,9 irons, maybe even a 7 but 6's and above a player's cavity back will outperform a blade every time. If it didn't, companies would still continue to make blades. Sales of blades have fallen to paltry numbers. One estimate I read was 2% of all golf sales are blades and that continues to fall. For me, I'm in love with the very thin topline of my X-blades and if player's cavity could reproduce that and be Endo forged I might just have to be all over that. One of the several reasons I'm about to put an Epon Type-S 3 iron in the bag is to try to get over the topline issue to my eye. I know sooner or later a few of the other higher irons will be replaced by player's cavity backs. I also want to return to a longer iron look with a little more forgiveness and length mixed in. I still want the sleek look of blades when viewed from above at address. The Type-S in a 3 iron fits that bill to a tee. Not to mention, its an Epon. Type J's may follow later down the line or maybe Epon will make an even cooler looking player's cavity that's more sleeker than the J's. Just take a look at the bags of many professional players. Quite a few have different styles of irons running throughout the bag. Many who still play 2 irons play the style of iron high handicappers play. They may have blades on the higher irons but many have cavities in the higher lofts. That says a lot because these guys don't play for fun, they play for a living. Its easy to overlook what our needs are and pump ourselves up to be better than what we are, but if we are to improve and shoot the scores we really want to, sometimes we need to be brutally honest with ourselves and sit down and truly break down our games and equipment and come up with the right solutions. I'd love to hear others take on this and please know I write this in the highest regard of anyone's game out there and I'm not trying to ruffle feathers, merely spewing out what my thoughts on all of this. In the search to constantly improve I've really thought long and hard about this. What's your take? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoon Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 Just take a look at the bags of many professional players. Quite a few have different styles of irons running throughout the bag. Many who still play 2 irons play the style of iron high handicappers play. They may have blades on the higher irons but many have cavities in the higher lofts. That says a lot because these guys don't play for fun, they play for a living. Its easy to overlook what our needs are and pump ourselves up to be better than what we are, but if we are to improve and shoot the scores we really want to, sometimes we need to be brutally honest with ourselves and sit down and truly break down our games and equipment and come up with the right solutions. I'd love to hear others take on this and please know I write this in the highest regard of anyone's game out there and I'm not trying to ruffle feathers, merely spewing out what my thoughts on all of this. In the search to constantly improve I've really thought long and hard about this. What's your take? well said. il be honest though, im always more drawn to how a particular club looks more than my actual ability to play it properly. hell i usually dont consider forgiveness in an iron until ive bit the bullet. when my father let me choose my first pair of clubs from his personal stash i was particularly drawn to his old school blades. he told me i was insane! i guess its an ego thing plain and simple. the guy sporting blades with xxstiff steel shafts is just oozing with machismo, not the same story though with his playing ability:) your observation about whats in a pro's bag is soo true. they do it for a living and a 1 stroke difference could mean not bringing home the bacon. and thats the difference, i play for fun and im not so penalized with trying to use gear beyond my playing abilities. easier said than done though:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
putt4doh Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 Just take a look at the bags of many professional players. Quite a few have different styles of irons running throughout the bag. Many who still play 2 irons play the style of iron high handicappers play. They may have blades on the higher irons but many have cavities in the higher lofts. That says a lot because these guys don't play for fun, they play for a living. Its easy to overlook what our needs are and pump ourselves up to be better than what we are, but if we are to improve and shoot the scores we really want to, sometimes we need to be brutally honest with ourselves and sit down and truly break down our games and equipment and come up with the right solutions. I'd love to hear others take on this and please know I write this in the highest regard of anyone's game out there and I'm not trying to ruffle feathers, merely spewing out what my thoughts on all of this. In the search to constantly improve I've really thought long and hard about this. What's your take? Great post! I think for the most part, recreational golfers realize this---even the good ones. Getting ourselves to believe it is another thing entirely. For instance, I ran into a friend of mine at the range who I hadn't seen in years. He plays maybe 2x a month and he's sporting a set of MP14's. I'm sure he's not a + hdcp (hit balls next to him); but he claims he hits the 14 better than any cavities. My apologies to anyone who feels the same, but the 14's (and clubs like them) are NOT game improvements irons! As for myself, I'm staring at a set of MR23 blades (smallest damn clubs I've ever seen) that I played for a while. Needless to say, I LOVE them! Sweetest feeling irons I've ever felt. Well, as I noticed my scores begin to rise, I decided to start keeping track of my stats (GIRs, FWs, putts, etc). After a number of rounds, it became clear I wasn't hitting nearly enough greens to shoot the scores I wanted to be. Switched them out for some B'stone CBs I got on the cheap---50% GIR's is the worst round I've had with them. That tells me all I need to know. Oh and did I mentioned I went a half flex softer (x1 to s4's). It's tough to shelf your ego, but sometime you have to weigh your priorities. For me I had to ask myself the question (no offense intended to anyone here): Did I want my bag to say 'player' or my scores? For me, it was a tougher question to answer than I thought..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indharbor Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 My take on blade vs cavity is little different. I've had and used all types of blades, cavity backs and so on. Cavity backs sure can help your game and improve fun part of the game but where do you get your fun from playing golf? IMHO, if you get satisfaction from using sexy looking blades, I think you should really stick with it. Your score may soar little bit but hey, we are not playing golf for living, aren't we? I thik pros switching to more forgiving cavity back type irons is natural trend since they play for living and one stroke could make a difference of day and night. For amateurs, if you enjoy playing with blades, I think it's way to go. For myself, I have recently had a chance to play blade and cavity back on same course back to back and interesting enough, scores were nearly the same, difference of less than 1~2 strokes. I am going with cavity backs only because they can produce shots that I desire more often than blades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoon Posted June 14, 2007 Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 My take on blade vs cavity is little different.I've had and used all types of blades, cavity backs and so on. Cavity backs sure can help your game and improve fun part of the game but where do you get your fun from playing golf? IMHO, if you get satisfaction from using sexy looking blades, I think you should really stick with it. Your score may soar little bit but hey, we are not playing golf for living, aren't we? I thik pros switching to more forgiving cavity back type irons is natural trend since they play for living and one stroke could make a difference of day and night. For amateurs, if you enjoy playing with blades, I think it's way to go. For myself, I have recently had a chance to play blade and cavity back on same course back to back and interesting enough, scores were nearly the same, difference of less than 1~2 strokes. I am going with cavity backs only because they can produce shots that I desire more often than blades. good point as well. as much as i like the look of the blades i am ruled by my scores and the stroke discrepancy is way more than two strokes for me:) when im betting with friends i will never part with my cb's. they are more forgiving than the pope., Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajaykkr Posted June 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 it did turn into a blade vs cavity debate..... Comparisons: 1) when lower GIRs with blades, assuming off the tee performance was the same 2) were the comparisons based on straight shots or shots that were faded or drawn, bend around trees to land on the green etc.... I have compared (i) miura CB 1006 with miura blades both with 1150 stiff (ii) Xblade CB2 with X blade 2 both with 1150 stiff (iii) MP-30 vs MP-33 (same shaft) both with S-300, Clubs from the same brand were used in the same rounds, by dropping a ball next to my where my tee shots landed on the same course. each time I hit two shots....straight, fade or draw depending on what could be done on the hole... the straight shots were not much different...but on the shots that were either faded or drawn, the blades were substanitially better..... Now there were ocassions when the straight shot was not a good option or was not an option at all (meaning i needed to lay up or needed to be less agressive in terms of how much closer to the flag i attempted) So when I add up strokes gained or lost.... i do count the odd iron shot i may hit badly (but if the bad shot from a blade or cavity both end up requiring another shot...it should be no different)...but I also count the shots that I did not have to hit... For me the blades were better.... But I dont mind the blade vs cavity trend as it helps me buy the blades that I like cheaply.... (BUT AS LONG AS THEY ARE PRODUCED) Also, I am a new golfer.... less than 2 years old in terms of golfing years....and i dont want lower scores in the round I will play today or tomorrow, I want much much lower scores in the round I will play 2 or 6 mths from now. I have noticed that blades give me more feedback, forcing me but more importantly allowing me to improve my swing dynamics... If i was not as good an iron player, maybe a different conclusion would have reached Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajaykkr Posted June 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2007 looks like a lot of guys have the mr-23 blades lying around... if you have a set in mint or better condition, pm me. heads only or shafted (ok with S-300, 1150 stiff) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blader-X Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 Just what I like. Lots of replies. We need more on this site from all kinds of golfers. Anyways I feel you ajaykkr. I truly love my blades and play very well with them. I've been playing for 20 years and have always challenged myself to get better. Advancing to the clubs I now play has helped me to do that. But as I look at the industry, and the evolution of the golf club, blades are on the demise. Companies just don't profit by making them. There's no denying that. Also, as I progress in years there will come a time when my skills will diminish and I'll have to start to throttle back. Until then I'll keep searching for the best clubs for my game and keep reading all you fellow TSG'ers posts. I go back and forth on this blade/player cavity back thing in my own mind as well. Its all so maddening and fun at the same time. Its not so much a debate as it is a discussion. Very fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idrive Posted June 15, 2007 Report Share Posted June 15, 2007 I grew up with a blade. One of my most cherished memories is buying a set of 1985 Palmer Standards. They were brand new.. had the new TT Dynamic Gold shafts, pinned and glued... Tiniest little blade, even smaller sweet spot. You had to hit the ball perfect to have a chance. Plenty of feedback, when I miss it's toward the toe. You could feel the club turn in your hand. The one thing it did make me do was concentrate. Perhaps I'm a better ball striker bacause of the clubs I grew up with. Hit well or suffer. I have experimented heavily over the last few years with the best Players cavity backs and blades. For me, the cavity back is a more rewarding Golf club. The EPONS at address have me thinking I'm playing a blade anyway. Throw in the forgiveness factor and it's an easy choice. I'm passed the macho factor of playing a blade. I admit, it was once a factor, but not any more. I'd rather walk up to the Green knowing I didn't hit my best shot and have the ball still be on the Green. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajaykkr Posted June 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2007 Rediscovering the MP 33s.... Recently saw a few MP 33s Brand New going for nothing on ebay, so I grabbed a couple of sets...I put them in the bag on Friday and have played 2 rounds with them since.... They have a nice high flight (as everyone knows) even with the S300..... But i love that flight... the ball gets thrown up in the air and lands softly.....(the lofts are slighly weaker,, but thats not the driver of the high flight).... Now i have read and heard that if anyone had any compliant with the MP 33s was heir higher flight which led MIzuno to bring out the 67... It raises a question for me.... have those amateurs who complained about the MP 33's flight ever seen Vijay or Tiger's flight with irons... Those guys flight is towering....its high and it allows them to land softly.... so why the gripe by amateurs... The MP 33 is in the bag for now displacing the xblade 2s and the mIura blades ... I tend to rotate my irons every other month or so....so not sure how long they will stay there... but am i gald that i grabbed those sets... and that too for a song... Anyone else have any thoughts on the MP 33's flights and why it works or does not work..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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