coops1967

or you should be looking at Mizuno 611, especially if prone to too much right to left ball flight. If you are a very strong player, or naturally have a high launch angle, then consider the Zero... but it is very, very low spin - and can be far too low spin for many/some golfers.

Get the Mizuno MP 611. 410cc, Endo forged titanium. Lovely shape, deep face, excellent performance ... and can be ordered 1 1/2 degree flat from standard, so lie angle of 56.5 degree.

Glad someone else is also enjoying the 611... I played another round at the old Railway course at Hua Hin... lovely driver. It does seem low spin... get a really nice flat looking trajectory ( mine's 10 degree also), seems lower spin than the Adams 9015d with the same Nunchuk shaft. Good solid sound, feel. Beautiful. I'd love to see it in matte black though... maybe one day.

Those irons aren't even new to Tourspecgolf either..... Golfcraft in Bangkok now stocks lots of S-Yard gear too... hmmm. Saw the T388 at last - wish i had camera to take comparison shots to my Mizuno 611. Put that very nice matte black look on the mizuno and it would be an easy win for the 611 I'd snagged a set of the Women's S-Yard iron heads for the wife - she's very happy with them, shafted with the NS 750 shaft, which is bonkers light - very effective. The 6 is undercut, and they look very decent and forged... not overly offset of too chunky. Best thing is i got them before the new arrivals - now you have no choice but to get them with the default pink graphite shaft.... and what's more.... PRICE of ONE iron club with the pink shaft?.......... 9000baht give or take ===> say about $300 US Oh, and there's another ladies iron club made from Titanium forged body, with a titanium face and tungsten weights.... would be up there with honma prices i guess. I've hit her S-Yards... nice. And look better than those men's XT stuff... http://www.tourspecgolf.com/images/Senifinasm.jpg

Interesting how long irons/utility irons are coming back again. With the modern iron designs it seems to me they can be designed to offer almost all the forgiveness of a hybrid with the easier lie adjustment and for some, just easier to the eye - in the same way hybrids offered almost all the forgiveness of a fairway wood (what happened to the 5 wood, it's gone so out of fashion...) in a more compact body. Any way you look at it, it means more choice for us - so it comes down to finding what works best for yourself. I'll just namecheck the Epon 901 here - been available for some time now... ahead of its time in some ways, you could say. Fabulous. I do love my 301 4 iron also, so i like long irons... and going from 23degree loft 4 iron to the 19 degree 901 is ideal. Only shame as far as a more driving iron is there is no lower loft option for the 901... i'd love a 16degree one with say a nunchuk hybrid shaft, as a 3 wood replacement. I currently don't put my 3 wood in my bag - when i started golf, i left out the driver and always used a 3 wood for many, many years... ( a Sam Snead persimmon head, steel shaft ) , in fact so many years i think i've used up all my allotted lifetimes worth of decent 3 wood shots, and can only now produce awful hooks and a range of foozled shots with them! some kind of mental 3 wood yips... so help me. A nice driving AF901 would be great... and a lot easier than this beauty

Have you had the opportunity to try the 388 next to the Mizuno 611? Just played another round with it and hit some very lovely drives. Has replaced my Adams 9015, really is a lovely looking thing and seems low spin and forgiving... wish i'd had the Nunchuk shaft respreayed black to match. The lower 56.5 lie seems great.

I love my 19 deg AF901. Forgiving without being ugly, and obviously lie can be bent to suit. I go from my Af301 4 iron at 23 deg then to this 901 at 19 which gives a good yardage gap. Use exactly same steel shaft as my other irons ( actually had it made up an extra half inch longer, ie 1" longer than the 4 iron). I'd say it's almost as forgiving as any hybrid, but for those who are freaked out/discombobulated by hybrids the 901 is perfect. Good feel too. Ball flight etc is up to you... use your favourite iron shaft and you can work the ball just same as any long iron. Ping HL 2 iron compared at address to the 901'

Any more info on the new X-01 balls? I used to love the X-01 G+ (?) but the newer X-01 solid was not so nice... went over to Srixon XV or TM Pentas....

The 'smaller' drive heads are plenty big enough.... so many people enjoy and have success with 3 woods of far, far smaller heads. Way smaller than any 380cc driver.... Here's a repeat pic of comparison with a ball of a Yonex 380cc, Adams 9015d at 460cc, and the Mizuno MP611 at 410cc. One thing that stands out to me if you compare the face of the Mizuno and the S-Yard T388 to most 460cc heads, is how much 'useful' face area there is - no 'wasted' space in the toe and heel... even the Adams has some of that face where you would never ever dream of hitting the ball off. The Yonex by comaprison to the S-Yard or the Miz 611 shown has a noticeably smaller hit area (yet plays just fine) Didn't someone thoeorise what the ideal head size was for maximum clubhead speeds? think it was around the 400c area.... With the continual improvement in designs and materials, the smaller heads of around 400c now, i think can be very close in terms of MOI ie forgiveness on off centre contact - yet have the benefit of looking smaller (less urge to try to flip/force the head closed) and just more pretty.... and a pretty driver is divine.

Whatever shafts suit you. Only difference is the old lofts will have a different number stamped on the sole. Only difference, apart from forgiveness of better design of modern clubs - higher MOI. The whole blades have a higher COG is a MYTH - that is, it is entirely wrong. Put a blade next to any SGI club of same loft, and there will be a very, very large difference in clubhead height - with the blade being shallower. If you make centre contact on the face, blades are perfectly easy to 'get up in the air' - just off centre they are not as forgiving as cavity backs etc. of course, why believe me... some random guy on the world wide webz denying a long held belief... that happens to be 98% utter b@llocks. Perhaps you'll believe a club designer. Well known, and has desgined blades thru to SGI... Thread here http://golf wrx/forums/topic/704348-why-are-some-people-so-mad-at-the-new-jacked-lofts-on-irons/page__st__120 and i quote " Now this observation is completely untrue. Everyone assumes that the CG on a muscle back blade is higher than a cavity back because you have all that thickness of metal centered on the back of the head, vs the big cavity in the back of the GI head. Not true at all because it is the iron head's HEIGHT that controls the CG location far more than another other design element. All clubheads have to be designed to end up a specific weight so they can all be built to a specific swingweight based on a specific length, shaft weight and grip weight. Let's take a 5 iron, just for an example - it's the same with every iron. Most 5-irons, whether blade or cavity, are made to be around 253 grams in weight. So if you are making a blade 5 iron, you can't make the height of that head as tall because you have all that thickness of metal on the lower 2/3's of the back which is pushing the weight up and up to that 253g level. On the cavity back, because you have this big hole on the back of the head, to get to that same 253g headweight, the only way you can get enough metal in the head to do that is either 1) make the sole extremely wide, 2) make the entire head taller. 98% of all cavity backs are much taller in head height than musclebacks for this very reason of head weight. And from this, you would find if you really did measure the vertical CG position that it is actually LOWER on most blade muscleback iron heads than it is on most cavity back irons. I know it doesn't seem that way when you look at the weight on the back of the heads, but I can quite assure you after 26 yrs of being a clubhead designer that this is what happens because in irons, head height is so influential in terms of head weight. Once in a blue moon you can see a GI or SGI iron that actually does have a lower CG than a blade. Not often though because to do this requires some very different design elements to be on the GI/SGI head - things like, 1) an extraordinarily wide sole, and many golfers have a limit for how wide of a sole they'll accept; 2) gobs of tungsten stuck down on the sole or lower back, and that adds some serious cost to the head - not to mention you have no idea how much tungsten is really on that head. Tear most irons apart that have a tungsten weight on the sole or lower back and you will find a few that are quite substantial in how much tungsten was put on the head - but you will find many that the tungsten is just a thin shell, is there more as a marketing thing, and does not comprise all that much weight to lower the CG. Bottom line: 98% of the claims that say "we had to make the lofts lower to counteract the effect of the low CG" are bogus - the company is saying this to cover up the fact that the real reason they lowered the lofts was to sell more clubs on the basis of this model hits the ball farther. " NOTE :- my first clubs were Sam Snead Blue Ridge blades.. with old leather grips and matching persimmon woods. BUT ever since I've bought my own clubs they've always been cavity backs... just nit with a thick topline or large Ping like offset, as that freaks me out ;-). .... because i started on old style clubs.

Oi! I've already got a lovely 19 degree driving iron, an Epon 901... admittedly, i'd like it in copper- chrome but..... if you could ask them to make any club you wanted... well, i admit it, i have a dream... :-)

Epon to produce an update to the Technicity 380. Keep same gorgeous top view pear shape, up the cc's to around 400 give or take ( the Mizuno 611 at 410 is lovely). Titanium cup face, Epon feel and sound, take the weight ideas from Ryoma and Adams 9015d for ball speeds. Have a fitting system with a few diff lofted heads, and adjustable lie and face angle, so they can fit to YOUR personal needs and the club made to your spec. Lie should be able to be specced from 54 degrees and up (too low? okay 55 and up ;-) ) Headweight to be specced to suit - 195 to 205 at least. No paint finish - nitride the titanium head instead, which will harden it, as well as produce an excellent finish. Think that should jst about do it! here's what nitrided titanium looks like...

Finally got the Nunchuk shaft for my MP 611... had it made up at Golfcraft, same as my Adams 9015D with Nunchuk at 44" length, both with gripmaster leather grips. Have only hit a few so far while indoors at Wilding Golf, and hit some with the Adams to compare. Initial impressions are very VERY promising. The Mizuno is flatter lie at 56.5 deg vs the Adams at 58 deg, but Adams is more open faced - Mizuno looks square to me, and i'm used to the open look so... certainly not closed faced. From the few hits, it seemed that the Mizuno is lower spin. Not crazy Epon Zero low spin, but lower than the Adams which is a legendary performer.I'll hopefully spend more time on a better LM later on to get a better number comparison, but for now the Mizuno was just as long or even longer which is no mean feat, and i liked the flatter lie. Sound seemed good too - indoors is not best place to be sure. Will be playing a round with it tomorrow. Looks gorgeous, feels lovely and so far seems to perform very well... i might finally have a replacement for the 9015D.

Still have my Epon covers, only use them when the clubs go on a plane, though... Think I saw more new at Golfcraft - black also i think.

I think Mizuno drivers are plenty forgiving enough - the last few MP versions (600's and above etc) and the JPX get very good reviews when tested (as do the Titanium fairway woods), it's just that they don't have the same aura and reputation as their irons, so they get unjustly ignored. It doesn't help when the best known Mizuno guy in USA and UK, Luke Donald, pulls out a white driver... as opposed to the well known Ping or Titleist guys who play their brand of driver. I know it's the money TM throw out to get the exposure, but how does it compare to Japan tour - do the Mizuno guys play Mizuno drivers and/or get more pay for play from Mizuno for the driver? Just curious... The combination of Endo made, smaller cc yet all Titanium (unlike yonex 380), shape, and the flat lie option were unresistable - and it looks as promising as i hoped. If it manages to perform as good as the Adams it'll be enough....

thanks for the pics - was looking/hoping for comparison to the T388 (I posted my 611 vs Adams 9015 and the yonex 380). They do look similar shape from on top. The Mizuno seems to sit square to me, which may mean it's a fraction open... I'm used to my Adams which is probably close to a couple degrees open. did you get the Mizuno at the flatter lie?

Unless it's being confused with Honma, which is Chinese owned...

Still waiting for another Nunchuk shaft for the head to head showdown with my 611 and my old Adams 9015D.... hope it's more forgiving than the Zero! Hope you sort it out ok - it looks too good to not use... 44 1/2" driver length may be worth looking at if you're playing it > 45" at moment?

Very nice. but you need copper-chrome 302's to match, surely?

I think i might have to get the boys at Golfcraft to respray the new Nunchuk shaft when it arrives... a purple shaft with that beauty just isn't right. Think Wilding golf centres have some new rdar/LM setup at some of their centres, so will compare them both then... hopefully soon, and hopefully beofr i have to return to work. The face view looks very encouraging, didn't realise how small the Yonex hitting area was before.

Very nice article that... must try not to get a look at that t388 in the flesh ;-) My wife is really liking her S-yard fw wood and hybrid, previous model to current ones, i think... i'd like to look at iron sets for her from s-yard, any news on when or what new iron desgins are expected?

My new Craft 611 10 degree at 56.5 degree lie arrived today! Stupidly I have only just ordered another Nunchuk shaft for it... so will have to wait for any reports on how it feels and performs. I was planning to just swap the shaft over from my Adams 9015D (with a Nunchuk shaft at 44" and Gripmaster Pittards grip), but realised it was time to just go ahead and get a backup shaft - i've been swinging much better after a visit to Dan Whitaker in the UK and working on the 3hrs lesson i had with him, and have been hitting some extremely good drives... even managing to hit a high fade when i wanted to on one occasion, so am very, very happy with the shaft and of course the Adams head is a legend in its own right (see a humongous thread devoted to it alone on golfwrx). As a result, i'm not even going to try the club as is - I don't want to put any bad vibes on it - I'm going to wait for the same shaft, and fit same grip etc etc then enjoy them both. Meanwhile here's a whole bunch of photo's, even the headcover (!) and pics comparing appearance of the 611 vs Adams 9015D vs Yonex380 My impressions appearance wise... Gorgeous. There are many ways to make an expensive driver look good, and i'd say Mizuno have chosen the 'anti-Honma' way Nothing flashy, no graphics or alignment at address, shaft installed with what little shaft labelling there is down, and even the head cover is a restrained piece of rather nice work. Very, very nice black shaft and head - maybe some extremely dark royal Mizuno blue in there, hard to say - but lovely. The headcover had micro perforations, quilting and I ended up smelling it, just to check whether they'd provided a real leather cover (!) - it's that good. Not sure how long it will last here in thailand, all poly headcovers start to rot after a year or so... Lovely shape, and the pics of all three drivers show just how good I think this head will turn out to be... the yonex 380cc head has a much smaller apparent face, whereas the 410cc Mizuno looks more like a slightly shrunk 9015D, with a nice big face with the bonus the beatiful top view. Miz 611 ordered flatter lie at 56.5 degrees lie, which i think is indicated by the yellow dot on the sole. It seems from it's construction that Epon are the foundry responsible.... so can't wait to see how it sounds and feels. Pics!!!! Loads and loads of them, no point in holding back - the comparison pics are at the end (!) Comparison Left to Right :- Yonex Ezone380, Adams 9015D, Miz Craft 611 Top to Bottom:- yonex, adams, mizuno

When I last checked the 302's against my 301's the lesser offset in the 302's was noticeable. Note the offset on the 301's is fine, not excessive... just that the slightly reduced amount on the 302's is very nice to my eye. Seem to remember the heel area top line is slightly different, again the 302 being a little smoother and better looking - the epon 301 heel area reminds me of my old Mizuno TP21's.. bit squarish and high heel topline. Mind you, i've been kind of avoiding looking at the 302's too much... avoiding temptation, as my 301's are perfectly great as they are. Now I just need to avoid any pics of 302's in copper-chrome... think someone on golfwrx has ordered a set You could produce a perfect mixed/blended set with the AF-Tours if you like, as the top line and offset is so similar. (And both are available in copper-chrome, ha).

302's have less offset than the 301's... pretty much same as AF- Tours. 302's have wider soles than 301's, and more going on in the back cavity. Both are lovely.

Googled that Fourteen Ute, and looks like same idea as my Epon 901... and my Epon has been bent 2 degrees up... and then 3 degrees down again, no problem whatsoever. It's a big advantage over modern hybrids.