TourSpecGolfer

These are backed up big time as Master Sasaya has become famous recently doing Aftermarket putter tuning. Ryo Ishihara had a Odyssey putter that had a sight line through all 3 pieces produced by Odyssey Golf and since then Sasaya has been geting hundreds of requests to do the same in Japan. The retail version doesnt have this feature. Its the big craze right now. Also his Scotty tunes are insane and picking up lots of traction in Japan. I will keep you guys posted sorry for the delay.

90% of the entire forging process. More than rough shape and yes both head and hosel. the Final 10% smooths the surface.

Something I should clarify In regards to Miura forging: The factory in Okayama-ken does 90% of the forging then Miura reheats it and uses a small pressing machine to smooth the surface. Still they are not forged in house just waned to update you guy's with that latest tid bit. Not discrediting the brand in anyway they make SOLID product.

The results will be known in about 19 days. Everyone is using S20C-S25C in their Japan Forged club heads.

Hi Keen, Your right China may have a decent quality 1018 but it's not feasible for the Factory to do a metallurgy test on each sheet before its used to produce golf clubs. The tolerance is very wide and the material is unreliable with 1018. On top of that my factory and design contacts even suggest against S10C or S15C for Golf Club production and still strongly claim that no one uses 1018 to produce golf clubs in Japan. Even the factory that Ishihara-shoten usually sources raw heads from from in Okayama-Ken doesn't use 1018. This is the most likely place that Scratch Heads come from. I know this is where the blanks for the TSG wedge were ordered from and Scratch sold those to me on the basis that they were 1018 Ishihara Forged. ** I do have to correct one thing I stated before ** ( The TSG wedge was not produced by Kyoei, with further research we know that Ishihara-Shoten outsourced the job to Asahi Golf who purchased the S25C blank from Okayama-Ken, we know down to the grinder who produced these wedges ). Its commonly known in the U.S, Japan, & China that S20-S25C is optimal for golf club production. Engineers in the U.S OEMs know this to be true and should inquire if they have any doubt. S20C is hardened to about the same level as S25C for best use. In fact Mizuno used to use S20C then switched to S25C, not sure about the reason but both materials cost about the same. Bottom line is that there is no reason to use 1018 from China over S25C JIS. It's a clear downgrade in materials.

Ya know it may be more credible if I use a customers wedge for the test. PM me I will compensate you for it. We will send a total of two Scratch wedges for testing. But no matter what the result we already know that 1018 is not the softest forging. As I mentioned before S10C and S15C are softer and JIS grade. Yet after heat treatment they feel about the same as S25C anyway. We can sell both as raw blanks if people are interested I would just have to bring in several hundred. Also keep in mind that it's confirmed that 1018 does not meet JIS standards and would be sourced from mainland China not Japan.

LSeca, your welcome here anytime. IMO you seem to want to focus on the person who is exposing the truth instead of company who has mislead the consumer. I will be 100% honest I did think 1018 Ishihara forged was a selling point. I used to think it was top grade stuff but in life you learn new things and over time working together with Japanese brands the truth came out. Nothing to hide. At first this was a simple blog post stating what i believe about 1018 and exposing that Ishihara doesnt forge golf clubs and trying to clear up misconceptions about certain things. Mostly opinion mixed with what I have learned over the last few years. But then when I read that Ari was saying I was dishonest and that all I care about profit things got heated. He spoke directly against me and my ethics. He said things that were quite frankly factually incorrect and he knew they were. That's why I began to lay it on even thicker and became more aggressive in exposing things they have said that are not true. I wish he stuck to the facts because I am more than happy to clear up anything that I am wrong about and apologize in a big big way. Yet he has no answers. Ari if your around show us how I'm wrong and I will retract everything, apologize on multiple boards and post your banners for a year. My motives are not sales guy's. the less scratch sells doesnt equal more sales for us in my opinion. For the most part our customers dont come from mainstreme forum boards. The majority of our customers don't post in any forums. I didnt think this blog post stating my honest opinion would bring in this much traffic and publicity. I will be 100% honest. I can admit I was upset that we sold our TSG wedge to customers based on the fact they are 1018 Ishihara Forged but other than that really no real motives until Ari decided to paint me as dishonest and greedy. His reason for us not working together is untrue also. In regards to Yururi, I agree those woods were horrible and yes they were open model. Their wedges and irons have been very solid though and I will add their latest hyrbid is 100% original design and they have removed the previous woods from the line up.

LSeca, First of all you say Yururi has 1018 on their wedge? It's 1.618 THE GOLDEN RATIO! You have mistaken the 6 for a 0! 1.618 LINK Yes most of these factories know the Yururi brand. In fact Asahi golf regularly copies their designs. Anything else to say about Yururi? The owner is one of my best friends. In regards to pay for play. "We Dont Pay Players" then they use on their website "Scratch is the only company on Tour that does not pay up front for players to use their clubs." Its 100% misleading. Check out the Hackers Paradise Forum where they go in depth on it. Ari participates himself and gets caught in some marketing spin. In fact on the same forum they independantly found multiple sources who confirm that Mr. Ishihara has passed away! What do you think my motives are? Trying to bring traffic to my website? or ....? Please explain. Let me put it simply someone is BS'ing everyone in the Industry, Golf Digest is printing this so are other publications and websites. If you don't have a side in this why don't you question them? On the WRX board and here you only question me when I have laid out 5 solid areas where scratch is misleading the public and Ari will not respond to these. Ari is not going to post anywhere that is not going to help him hide the truth. Do you have any comments on Ishihara Forged? Open Model Use? Mr. Ishihara of MOZ is still alive? Softest Metal in Golf? There are many people who back this info up in Japan. Ya know how many can back up Ari's claims?... none that I can find.

Their clubs NOT being made of 1018 is simply my opinion because my logic and every expert I speak to tells me why would they select an inferior metal bringing it in from China when S25C JIS is available to them at a fair price. The only reason would be cost. So far none of the grind factories and foundries i regularly speak with have ever heard of any golf company using 1018 for golf clubs in Japan. It's simply not a good material to use for golf clubs no matter what is done to the metal. Scratch really has no idea where their clubs are being produced or who produces them on a day to day basis. Ishihara-Shoten outsources scratch orders to various factories and grinders. I know people first hand who are seasonal grinders who have actually ground Scratch wedges at different places on different days. For example Ishihara-Shoten receives the order from scratch and will try to use the most economical grind house to produce their clubs. Often its Asahi Golf's team because they offer the lowest prices. BUT if Asahi is at max capacity the job will go to a different factory. How it works in the Japanese grind industry is a group of often the same grinders go from factory to factory looking for work. For example if a grind studio has 30 grind employees usually 20 of them are seasonal. A grind man who works at facotry X will also go to Factory Y or Z or a bunch of other factories for work. It all depends on what factory has the Jobs available. When Scratch say's Ishihara Forged or Forged by Ishihara-Shoten its 100% false. They don't forge golf clubs I know I sound like a broken record but I'm not BS'ing anyone with this. Their public records show they are not a foundry. They are classified as a Golf Shop and all my contacts back up the fact that they are middle men for manufacturing. Again common knowledge in the Japan golf industry but in the U.S nobody knows. They are questioning my integrity and word calling me dishonest when they have twisted the facts that they don't pay tour players anything, that their product is forged by Ishihara-Shoten, that Mr. Ishihara of MOZ didn't pass away, that there is a special heat treatment that makes 1018 good for golf clubs, that the TSG wedge was 1018 Ishihara forged and that their Irons are Original Designs.

I just orderd a set of AF-502's with Crazy The Longest Yard Shafts in Stiff as a personal set. I will of course take pics and let you know how these high end graphite shafts work out.

XXIO, There were more than a few inquiries made by me as well as many customers about their use of open model heads. IMO the gentleman's game does extend to the industry for the most part but what part of gentlemans game do you see in what IMO is directly misleading the consumer? My benefit of the doubt extends to perhaps they dont know as much as they say they do about their process because Shoten acts as a middle man for manufacturing. I consider myself pretty knowledgeable on open model heads from Japan and Taiwan. If a product is open model being passed off as original mold or the company is charging original design type prices you will see me take issue with it. What sort of proof would you like to see? In the above case this is an extremely popular open model head, although dated the companies that use it simply adjust the mold or grind instead of paying new mold fee's and producing thousands of sets. All 3 scratch models are Open Mold. It's OK they are decent clubs but the other brands are not publicly saying they use only "original molds" that only they produced. The least they could have done is do a CNC design in the sole raising the cost - value ratio but they went with a basic logo stamping. Brands far bigger than scratch can't afford original design fee's. ( CAD, Mold, Min Qty ) please visit their HQ and then let me know if you think they have millions to blow producing 3 irons that are identical to open model offerings.

There was an good question/comment in the blog and I wanted it into this conversation: James T. Asked: My Reply: It isnt only the carbon content that is reason why it will not be JIS certified but also the tolorance of other minerals, strength, and PSI. In europe they of course don’t use JIS, I think they have EN & ASCI which not as scrutinized as JIS, I haven’t researched if it meets EU standards or if EN1018 exists but ASCI 1018 is considered to have a relatively low tensile strength, but it is cheap and malleable. We are big supporters of Japanese quality and the company in question has been making claims that were untrue and causing confusion to those who are not as educated about the manufacturing process in Japan. The carbon content itself can overlap in 1018 steel just as other JIS materals can overlap but the range of that overlap and the amount it can overlap in carbon AND other minerals is not acceptable. This isn’t only a carbon or mineral issue it also involves other factors. JIS ( Japan Industry Standard ) is very important to us and our customers it certifies the level of quality the material of a golf club is made at in our industry. To put it another way IMO it’s like comparing USDA PRIME grade beef to USDA CHOICE graded beef in america. The beef must have a certain amount of fat and other requirements to be considered USDA highest grade, well in this case the metal must meet not only carbon but other mineral amounts and then tolorance and tensile strength requirements to hit the bare minimum of the JIS grading system. The Japanese Industry Standard system is used across just about every industry in Japan. In fact there has been controversy when a Japan home builder built homes using non JIS materials and parts and was heavily criticized due to the homes durability during an earthquake. There have also been complaints when appliances have malfunctioned causing harm or fire and the non JIS parts were part of the focus or blame. If there was a building made of 1018 vs S25C and a fire broke out the home made of 1018 in theory would crumble first. For the Japanese in the golf equipment industry and taiwanese they did not need to do any research to know that 1018 was not up to par. It was a matter of simply mentioning 1018 and each of our sources said along the lines of ” thats not from here ” It’s a mainland China material. But we researched it any. The company in question is supposed to be of the highest quality in golf as advertised, Could you imagine a fine dine resturaunt serve CHOICE grade beef and passing it off as PRIME to it’s customers

I dont see it that way XXIO, I said "some" benefit of the doubt. Being in business for 7+ years and visiting the foundry Ari couldn't of been completely in the dark. He knew about open model heads because we confronted him about it AND posted it. Further proof of that is he has denied it in two forums that called him on it. Do you not think those are open model heads? In regards to GT & DW I know the name was taken from Darren Eggars. Both men have issues and both have moved on. No angels in that situation. The purpose of the blog post was to clear up misconceptions that is common knowledge in the Japan Golf Industry. Furthermore, It's not simply about carbon contents it's also about material tolorences and where that material was originally produced. The tolerance is too drastic in 1018. The Miura issue has been common knowledge in Japan. No single OEM of that size has a forging press unless they are producing 3000 sets per month of their own product....none.

Just to clear things up there are 3 Ishiharas. let me explain: - Ishihara MOZ : The famous wedge grinder and hand polisher who founded the brand MOZ and died 2 years ago from stomach cancer. - Ishihara-Shoten : This is a middle man company that works between manufactures and the actual factories ( they do not forge golf clubs ). - Ishihara Store : This is the company that recieved the rights to Ishihara MOZ brand with a trademark transfer. they are only a golf shop. Scratch Golf has been saying for years that their product is Ishihara forged. We are 100% positive that Ishihara-Shoten acts as a middle man and has never forged a golf club. they handle the orders and outsource the labor to various factories. This may explain why the TSG wedge was produced of S25C at kyoei. We are surprised that Scratch Golf uses Ishihara-Shoten to act as the middle man in producing their products. It adds an extra expense & A LOT of time delay for orders. This is usually the case with non Japanese companies trying to have golf clubs produced in Japan. The above is all FACT not rumors or opinion. Thank you for your question. The ONOFF CB247 is forged from S25C. Miura outsources their Forgings and Platings yet handles the grinding and quality control for their products. It's pretty interesting the head is forged separatly from the hosel piece and then Miura spins the hosel piece so fast that it gets hot and is able to stick to the head portion of the forging. This is a good way to create a tight tolerance. It also allows them to produce an iron using 2D which is more flat on the press and easier thus making it more affordable. I don't know the source for certain but my best sources all say an East Osaka foundry. It is high quality JIS grade S25C steel. In regards to your question about S20C vs S25C after heat treatment you really can't tell it boils down to the design of the golf club and the method of manufacturing. I really dont think the issue is about whether or not they use 1018 but rather what exactly 1018 is and where it comes from. 1018 comes from mainland China and you can research this on your own via google. 1018 is of such a poor quality that Japan will not give it the JIS ( Japan Industry Standard ) rating. JIS Rated Steel: S10C, S15C, S-20C, S25C, S35C, S45C, & S50C The JIS standard is used in materials, appliances, electronics, automotive, architecture, and most other industries. It's a big deal in Japan and everything produced in Japan carries a JIS rating as a sign of Japan's high standards in quality. Scratch Golf is having a tough time due to controversial marketing tactics: 1. The no pay for play controversy, they market they dont pay their players but people found out they only pay if they win. 2. The we produce original molds controversy - It's proven that their iron heads are Open Model catalog heads that have existed for almost 10 years at half the price. 3. The recent 1018 from mainland China controversy - we just broke this news a couple of days ago. 4. The Ishihara Forged controversy - Ishihara doesn't forge golf clubs & we just broke this news a couple of days ago. 5. The so called TSG 1018 Ishihara Forged wedge wedge controversy ( It was actually S25C produced by Kyoei ) We can however give them some benefit of the doubt as they do not deal directly with manufactures and use Ishihara-Shoten as a middle man so they may not know exactly what is happening on the production end of their product.

Epon 302's are some of the best if not the best irons on the market today. I'm happy you enjoy them, the polish of the instal and the QC is Endo at its finest!

The FE is forged then milled then a finish is applied. Yes Private Stock is an FE " Forged " putter. Yes SUS303 is milled from a solid block.

I would suggest having it done on your side, PRGR has never been a brand to offer a whole lot of custom options. Other companies no problem if you want factory. Another option is to have our guys in Japan do the install for you before it ships but im afraid the KBS wedge shaft may cost more that way.

Hi Vineman, SUS303 will provide a more firm or clicky feel at impact while FE is a more muted and soft impact. That pretty much sum's up the differences that you will notice.

Thank's Hawk, Checkout page 2 it has topline pics of the PRGR sir.

IF you have images of the 210KGX they are not of the model that will be released.

Its unfortunate but the new V grooves are +50.00 from SkyDream Jump. Weird, I dont know where they get that from. Technically they are not V grooves, I have no idea why people use that term, Up close they are more "double R" grooves because the edges have been rounded.

Hey Bogey, It's gonna be a little while until the mainstreme JDM fan gets the jist that SkyDream Jump wedges are up there with the best of them. Great news is that TSG just secured total and exclusive U.S distribution rights to the brand. We were sketchy at first because we have had a few issues with them and almost decided not to move forward and then they assured us that these problems would be resolved and the final push forward was our actual customers who purchased the wedges saying they were by far the best they have ever had. Sky Dreap DP-2010 images: PRGR

Hey Hawk, The ONOFFs are already out. In fact they are called the limited Shingo wedge. Almost sold out also. The Epon's should be out early April.

several issue's, in one case there was excess metal build up under the finish at the corner of the grooves. Another issue was that the finish cracked when a good member tried to bend them a minimal amount. They are aware of these issues and have been working hard to fix them.

Cleveland CG15 Japan Only Forged Model: Click Here to Read on GolfToImpress.com