Vijay's specs

[jeffy]

I got the new Golf Digest today and the current "What's in my bag profile?" is of Vijay Singh. After reading it, all I can say is "YIKES!!!". I knew he had a funky release but I had no idea how unconventional it really is. How unconventional? Well, his driver face angle is 5 degrees open!

There was one thing I didn't understand and maybe one of our clubmaking maetsro's can help here. As many of us know, Vijay carries a Callaway 9 wood. What I didn't know, and don't really understand, is his description of it: he says "it is bent 7 degrees open to a 7 wood loft but plays more like a 5 wood". Huh? How can GD publish something as obscure as this with no explanation? I'd be grateful to anyone who can explain what Vijay is talking about.

Another extraordinary item was that he plays his irons (and often doesn't change grips) until the grooves on them are worn out, which he says, happens about every 6 months. Whaaaat?! How many balls does this guy hit? I doubt that Hogan, Snead, Nicklaus, etc. replaced their irons anywhere near this often.

In all, something of an eye-opener. In some ways, it makes me feel that some things are best left unknown...

Jeff

[MGB]

HE WEARS OUT HIS IRONS IN 6 MONTHS? :surprize:

[Godfather1]

The only thing I can think of is that he likes the size of the 9 wood. A while ago someone printed something like this about a different pga pro for a 3 wood he used a 7 wood since he liked the size of it but had the specs of a 3 wood. :-D :surprize:

[billm311]

The only thing I can think of is that he likes the size of the 9 wood. A while ago someone printed something like this about a different pga pro for a 3 wood he used a 7 wood since he liked the size of it but had the specs of a 3 wood. :-D  :surprize:

That other pro was Rich Beem. He uses a 7 wood "bent" to be a 3 wood because the appeal of the small size. You can do this because when you change the face angle (closed-square-open) you also alter the loft of the club.

Example, when I had my 3 wood reshafted, I had the clubmaker open the cubface a bit. Standard specs on my club was 2* closed with 15.5* loft. Now the club has 1* closed with 16.5* loft. It plays like a 4 wood now.

My 5 wood was also changed. 18* loft at 4* closed became 21* loft at 1* closed. It now plays weak compared to other 5 woods, almost like a 7 wood.

[billm311]

some research says callaway divine nine wood had 24* loft, no info on face angle. You can alter face angle to alter loft, but his specs are extreme, so it was probably custom made anyway

somewhat confusing, but easy to grasp if you have seen it. For instance, a standard tour 3 wood will have 13* with a square face.

If you were to buy a 3 wood with labelled 13* loft, but 1* closed, if you bend it to square, it will have 14* of loft.

[jeffy]

Yeah, yeah, I understand the examples given, but, forgive me, they don't explain how bending a 9 wood 7 degrees open gives it the loft of a 7 wood, even if you rotate the club 5 degrees closed through impact.

I'm still confused...

Jeff

[kr0nik]

Uh-oh. Here we go again.

[shoe295]

Uh-oh. Here we go again.

just what I thought except I agree with jeffy...if you bend a 9 wood open 7* to get it to be a 7 wood means rotating that thing at least 10* closed..holy snap hook batman.. :surprize:

of course I don't swing like vijay on purpose...repeat holy snap hook..

500 balls per day..180 days...90,000 whacks in 6 months...that'd wear me out much less the clubs... :wink:

[Jwill]

Actually if you bend a club open the loft decreases. That it why Vijay plays a 10.5º head bent 5º open. For every degree you open the clubface it is like .75º less loft. Dosen't make sense but thats how it works. Hence the 9 wood bent open is listed at 18º. Only problem with that is that Callaway woods cannot be bent becuase they dont have a hosel so it had to be shimmed wide open. So for the person who bent their woods open, you actually have a strong 3 and 5 wood rather than a 4 and 7 wood. :-D

Joe

[Jwill]

If you have any questions about that just let me know I will try to explain it so it makes sense to everyone...

Joe

[jeffy]

I'm sorry, but I still don't think that explains what is said in the article. I understand and agrree that if a club has 9* of true loft and is 2* open, the effective loft (i.e., the loft when the club face is square to the target line) is 7*. That makes sense. Presumably, Vijay's driver had true loft (loft at address) of 10.5* untouched, was bent open 5* to 15.5* of loft, but still has 10.5* of effective loft when Vijay rotates it to square at impact.

However, run through the numbers on Vijay's 9-wood and explain how it comes out to 18*, assuming it starts with 24*. I've tried every way I can think of but can't get there...

My current bet is that either Vijay or Golf Digest or both got it wrong. I met someone from GD on Thursday and he has emailed the editor of the article for an explanation. I'll post it here if and when I get it.

Jeff

[AVG_JOSEPH]

When they "Open" the clubface they are not adding loft. They are bending the hosel back and flatter, rotating the face open and decreasing effective loft. Vijay's driver becomes about an 8 degree driver. The hosel is actually rebored on the cally 9 wood and the same principle is done. Shaft is inserted closer to the heel and further back on the clubhead and exits the sole closer to the toe and nearer the face. This has the same effect of lessening the loft that the club plays.

[jeffy]

Ahhh... I see. By bending or reboring the hosel in this way, the grip end of the club is in effect moved away from the club face. When the player addresses the ball with his hands in their normal position, the club is effectively delofted but still square. Brilliant!

Thank you AVG_JOSEPH for the explanation!

This explanation raises another question, however. The article quotes Vijay as saying: "my driver has a 5-degree open face". What do you think he really means: that his driver was "bent" open 5-degees, decreasing the effective loft, or that it was built with a face angle that sits 5-degees open when the club is set properly at address?

Jeff

[sigmamason]

Another extraordinary item was that he plays his irons (and often doesn't change grips) until the grooves on them are worn out, which he says, happens about every 6 months. Whaaaat?! How many balls does this guy hit? I doubt that Hogan, Snead, Nicklaus, etc. replaced their irons anywhere near this often.

Jeff

Vijay has an unbelieveable work ethic on his game, he will after a round go hit balls until the range closes, then he hits before his tee time. If he misses the cut, he will work all day on his game. He is rumored to spend a minimum of 4 hrs a day hitting balls and working on his game, along with time in the gym...

A few years back, Tiger did the same thing. Many of the pros will wear certain clubs, most wear out wedges every couple of months, simple because they are constantly practicing their short game all the time.