Posted September 27, 201113 yr Can someone explain the pros and cons of each... also, i'd love to hear comparisons in terms of feel, kick, distance, spin, dispersion, etc if anyone's tried both. ALSO - Can someone list all the full boron shafts to date... I know of the Diamana Stinger and apparently the Honma ARMRQ and Matrix ozik TPHD shafts are....
September 28, 201113 yr I think they're was a Fuji full boron but it was really high torque, not what you're looking for.
September 28, 201113 yr I suggest comparing Boron Fiber to Carbon Fiber. 80T is just the press weight of the flat carbon prepeg. btw 80 ton isn't the big deal as 1200T can be found at nearly the same price. What's special about the 80T carbon in high end shafts is the Japanese manufactures that produce it and the technique. Boron's time has come and gone. In aerospace, golf, bicycling, etc.. Advanced and hybrid fibers in particular carbon fibers have replaced it. Boron is a very limited application where as CF has a lot of attributes that can be manipulated. Boron is a very rigid and strong because the process is started with a string of tungsten and the boron is created around it through a process. In some application's its as hard as a diamond. on a scale of 1-10 and a 10 is diamond hard it's a 9.5 That said it isn't as strong as newer high modulus carbon fibers. Boron and Carbon fibers can also be very dangerous the fibers are so thin and sharp they can be carried by bloodstream and in military applications have been the cause of aneurysm's brain and pulmonary. be careful when cutting! How it applies to the golf shaft. Not very well, It's inconsistent in flex, weight, and durability. Boron always has structural defects and morphological irregularities. It does not conduct vibration as well as carbon either. Boron is very expensive because of the tungsten string in the center. The Future is in hybrid mixes of carbon fibers as well as carbon nano tubes. While we are on this topic another interesting tid bit is Graphite vs Carbon Sheets. During the heat treatment process if carbon fiber is heated above 2500*C it becomes graphite. It's bonds break and it reorganizes into a more stable graphite form. Here is a link if you want to get a general overview of this: Click Here
September 28, 201113 yr That was super informative, thanks a bunch Chris. I know a lot about playing the game of golf, and Im fortunate enough to be able to scoop up every club or piece of equipment I could ever want, but my knowledge of the materials, manufacturing techniques, and the differences and benefits of various material and manufacturing techniques is kinda lacking, but I'm def always interested in learning about it and broadening my knowledge of those areas.... You mentioned the future being in hybrid mixes of Carbon fibers and Carbon Nanotubes, I'm curious to know more about these, what are they specifically? What are the benefits? and are there any manufacturers/shafts using this now? I'm hoping I'm not asking any dumb questions, I honestly would have no way of knowing if I am because I'm just not very educated in these areas... J.
September 29, 201113 yr nanotubes is the future. saw a documentary in natl geo featurung a russian company called Rusnano that was making nanotube skin that had applications from nanotech surgical instruments all the way to satellites. im sure this technology has somewhat found its way to golf with the advent of Graphite design newer products which it worked in collaboration with Toray. future of the Golf shaft looks promising. crazy to think what super high end golf shaft will be available by 2015!
September 29, 201113 yr nanotubes is the future. saw a documentary in natl geo featurung a russian company called Rusnano that was making nanotube skin that had applications from nanotech surgical instruments all the way to satellites. im sure this technology has somewhat found its way to golf with the advent of Graphite design newer products which it worked in collaboration with Toray. future of the Golf shaft looks promising. crazy to think what super high end golf shaft will be available by 2015! Yonex beat everyone to it ... at least in their marketing strategy :)
September 29, 201113 yr Yonex beat everyone to it ... at least in their marketing strategy :) Lol, theyve been using nano liberally indeed. even their headcovers look high-tech
September 29, 201113 yr We have Dr. Darren around here somewhere. He's a nano scientist and has actually worked with golf OEM's. Hopefully he reads this and can chime in. We go to the nano fair every year. It's the same time as the Tokyo Golf Show and even in the same building. Lot's of golf applications. From what I understand is the "good stuff" is too expensive for mainstream golf applications today. If it's considered expensive in Japan it's totally out of reach for the U.S. Expect to see it in golf ball covers first. Let's hope Japan's economy flourishes because when it does every industry see's a boost of new tech.
September 29, 201113 yr I'm all for the best tech possible in shafts... I feel like the market will be there almost regardless of the cost, there will always be enthusiasts that will pay the highest premiums for the absolute top quality, i mean look at the amount of members on this forum that own or have owned many of the top of the line shafts available.... I couldn't imagine how much better graphite shafts could get, what's available now is just soooo fantastic, I for one would def be first in line for something that's proven to be of even higher quality/technology than whats available now if they can manage it.... J.
October 5, 201113 yr We have Dr. Darren around here somewhere. He's a nano scientist and has actually worked with golf OEM's. Hopefully he reads this and can chime in. We go to the nano fair every year. It's the same time as the Tokyo Golf Show and even in the same building. Lot's of golf applications. From what I understand is the "good stuff" is too expensive for mainstream golf applications today. If it's considered expensive in Japan it's totally out of reach for the U.S. Expect to see it in golf ball covers first. Let's hope Japan's economy flourishes because when it does every industry see's a boost of new tech. Hey Chris, only just spotted this (been a slack poster of late), so I will just say the following. If you scour the golf patent literature you'll find nano-additives in composite reinforcement (eg carbon nanotubes, graphene, layered silicates, polysilsesquioxanes or POSS), in adhesives, and yes in golf ball cores, mantles and covers (even clear coatings!). Often it's there but some companies prefer not to market with nano branding. Public awareness and nano health and safety still has some ground to cover, and to be honest the nano thing has all been pushed a bit too hard too early in some fields. Some of the early stuff was opportunistic and rubbish (from a purely technical viewpoint) - lately there's some great new technology going into products. I can tell you first hand it's happening! I really enjoyed my 2 trips to the JP Golf Fair and Tokyo NanoTech Trade Fair (07 and 09 I think) - bumped into Chris both times - hope to do it again one year soon! Cheers D
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